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Wisdom for Wannabes Episode 73
​Interview 41 of 52:

I wanna be better at ​MENTAL TRAINING
for ​CYCLING & SPORTS

< Last interview
Picture
Featured Guest:
Peggy Maass Labiuk

2x National Cycling Champion
Co-Author, Cycle Psyched

Published Date: August 31, 2026


In this episode of Wisdom for Wannabes, Peggy Maass Labiuk shares the mental strategies she used during an extraordinary cycling career that included competing on the U.S. National Team, becoming a two-time national champion, earning a World Championships medal, and setting a 24-hour endurance cycling world record. Peggy is also the co-author, with sports psychologist Dr. Saul Miller, of Cycle Psyched: Pro Wisdom and the Mental Training to Excel. Their latest book brings together mental-performance lessons and insights from more than 90 world-class cyclists. We talk about confidence, self-talk, goal setting, visualization, fatigue, peak performance, and what happens when you change the conversation happening inside your own head.
Listen to/watch the full podcast recording, or read the transcript below:

Full Interview with Peggy Maass Labiuk:

"Change what you're telling yourself. When you say, 'Here comes that big hill.' Shift that into more positive self-talk. Set little goals. That builds your confidence. That’s for everyone." 
- Peggy Maass Labiuk (Wisdom for Wannabes episode 72, 03:05)
Great quotes from the interview:​
  • "You still need to tap into: What is your mind saying? What is your heart telling you?”
  • “You want to change what you're telling yourself.”
  • “Goal setting instead of, ‘Well, we'll see how it goes.’”
  • “You absolutely can train confidence.”
  • “Your preparation is everything.”
  • “That's how I'm going to finish the race. I'm going to win that way.”
  • “That was in the moment, turning it around from wanting to exit to winning.”
  • “Sometimes we minimize what those little things are. They're not little things, they're big steps.”
  • “You have one mind, one brain. We're relying on that.”
  • “Making them digestible bites, but documenting it and celebrating it each time.”​​

(More great quotes throughout the transcript in purple below.)
Picture
Peggy Maass Labiuk, 2x National Champion Cyclist
Key Takeaways:
​​
  • Why confidence is something you can train
  • How positive self-talk can change your performance
  • What to do when your brain says, “I want to quit”
  • Why small goals build confidence
  • The difference between data and listening to your own mind
  • What peak performance actually feels like
  • How visualization can help athletes
  • Peggy's “eagle” mindset
  • The mental lessons cycling can teach us about life
  • An exercise from Cycle Psyched you can try this week

Interview Transcript:

Jackie Morreale (00:00)
Hello and welcome to Wisdom for Wannabes, the podcast that seeks wise words in business, beauty, and betterment. I am the host, Jackie Morreale. Today, we're talking about something every athlete, really every human being, has to learn how to train: the mind.
 
My guest is Peggy Maass Labiuk, a former U.S. national team cyclist, two-time national champion, world championships medalist, and 24-hour endurance cycling world record holder.

Peggy is the co-author of the book, Cycle Psyched: Pro Wisdom and the Mental Training to Excel, written with world-renowned sports psychologist Dr. Saul Miller, who has spent more than 40 years working with elite athletes and professional teams.

The book draws on the wisdom of more than 90 world-class cyclists and explores confidence, self-talk, goal setting, visualization, and the mental skills that can help us perform at our best.

 
Peggy, welcome to Wisdom for Wannabes! It is so great to have you here.
 
Peggy Maass Labiuk (00:58)
Thank you, Jackie. Thanks for hosting.
 
Jackie Morreale (01:00)
Let's take it all the way back to the beginning. Why did you write a book?
 
Peggy Maass Labiuk (01:05)
Years ago, Dr. Saul Miller was working with the Canadian National Cycling Team. I was on the US team, but had lots of connections with the Canadians. After I retired from racing, I was hired as the Provincial Cycling Coach for British Columbia. We were seated together
 
at an awards banquet. We were talking and hatched the idea of writing a book together. Saul had already done three, and I had done some writing for magazines. That was probably written down on a napkin. Off we went.
 
Jackie Morreale (01:37)
The napkin and the rest is history.
 
Peggy Maass Labiuk (01:39)
Yeah.
 
Jackie Morreale (01:40)
The first book that you wrote together, Sport Psychology for Cyclists, was published in the early 2000s. Are there any areas of cycling psychology that you understand differently today, 25 years later?
 
Peggy Maass Labiuk (01:52)
There's more information about how the brain works and how it heals. The sport itself has really changed. People can monitor so much more. You have wattmeters on your bike, GPS, smartwatches. That's great to have all those numbers, but you still need to tap into:
  • What is your mind saying?
  • What is your heart telling you?
 
That's why we wanted to look at what the new athletes are doing and talking about. There's certainly more discussion these days about the mental side.
 
There are quotes from over 90 different athletes, but we still kept our workbook format, which sets it apart. It's not just talking about the mental side; it's how to use it.
 
Jackie Morreale (02:34)
There's so much useful, empowering information for every cyclist, every athlete, every person who wants to feel a boost in what they're doing.
 
Who should read this book? I think everyone. But who should read it? And what is one take-home message that you want every reader to receive?
 
Peggy Maass Labiuk (02:55)
Being a coach, working with people who might think that, 'All this stuff is for elite'... it's not. It's for everyone, anyone on two wheels. Old teammate Leslie Schenck is a yoga instructor. She uses the book for her yoga for athletes.
 
You want to change what you're telling yourself.
 
People are telling themselves things. They are using self-talk, but it could be better. That's what the book is about.
 
When you say, 'Here comes that big hill.' Whoa, let's stop that. Shift it. Give more positive self-talk.
 
Goal setting instead of, 'Well, we'll see how it goes.'
 
Set little goals.
 
That builds your confidence.
 
It's for everyone.

 
Jackie Morreale (03:38)
Leslie Schenk at Tune Yoga, awesome use case of Cycle Psyched. This book is so important in yoga and other sports as well.
 
After writing these two books together over two decades, is there anything that you understand about each other that you didn't know when you first met?
 
Peggy Maass Labiuk (03:54)
The first book, Saul contributed more. I was a little less confident in my writing and ideas. This second book was more collaborative and more fun. We had fun.
 
Jackie Morreale (04:06)
Just like in cycling, if you set those goals, 20 years later, second book, more collaborative, more confident, more fun.

One of the things I love about Cycle Psyched is how you use imagery to help athletes get into the right mindset. Can you tell us about an example of how you use that kind of imagery in cycling?
 
Peggy Maass Labiuk (04:12)
My teammate, Betsy Davis, said, 'The last lap is like the start of a horse race. It doesn't matter what's happened before then. There's one lap to go. You come out of the gate charging and you go for one lap.'
 
That's such great imagery. The sounds, the gate, the bell going: Brrrrring!, and then boom, and the gate opens and charge.

 
Jackie Morreale (04:34)
That's amazing that you have so many different talents, on the road, with horses.
 
I want to take it back to books. This book is an option by the way… what is your favorite book of all time?
 
Peggy Maass Labiuk (04:44)
Harry the Dirty Dog by Gene Zion. You can find it online. You can listen to Betty White read Harry the Dirty Dog. But I don't want to listen to it because I hear my mother reading it to me.
 
And of course, our first book. Our first book was special because that was quite an accomplishment.
​
(Continued below)
Picture
Peggy Maass Labiuk and Cycle Psyched co-author, Dr. Saul L. Miller
Picture
Peggy teaching a seminar on the key concepts in Cycle Psyched
(Continued)
 
Jackie Morreale (05:06)
Congratulations. That's an amazing thing. Sport Psychology for Cyclists.
 
Now Cycle Psyched this year. Love Spring Cedars. Shout out to Audrey. Congratulations.
 
Let's take it back to cycling. Favorite mantra for sports performance?
 
Peggy Maass Labiuk (05:21)
I tend to keep it really simple, like:
  • 'You got this.'
  • 'Yes, you can.'
  • Or the old Nike, 'Just do it.'
 
I like things that I can count, get me in a rhythm, get my breathing attached. Real simple.
 
Jackie Morreale (05:35)
Just do it.
 
Picturing Peggy on round 25 of a 40-loop course, feeling like you can do it. Focus on love and not your pain. Is that something that you've actually been able to do in practice?
 
Peggy Maass Labiuk (05:47)
I think we would call it mastery in sport.
 
You're not having to think about your cornering, so you can think more about what's happening next. Where do I want to be in the pack?
 
In my last couple of years racing, there were times where I just wanted to pull out of the race.
 
I wanted to quit. I'd had enough.
 
Right there in the race, you've got to stop that. You've got to turn that around.
 
One race I was doing that. I started to look like, 'Well, I could pull out there. I could pull out there.' That's pretty bad. Okay, switch, switch. I tested in one race, like, 'Okay, I'm going to test for the finish.' Here's my preparation in the race.
 
I went for a pream lap. There's a prize for that one lap, whoever crosses the line first. The bell goes. On the back straight, and I'm going to be first through turn number three, turn number four. Yes, I did that.
 
I'm like, 'That's how I'm going to finish the race. I'm going to win that way.'
 
And I did!
 
I use that photo a lot, that photo finish, because the second place person was the Olympic champion. So, I out-sprinted Monique Knol, who won the Olympics in '88.
 
That was in the moment, turning it around from wanting to exit to winning.
 
Jackie Morreale (06:58)
I need to know what your ‘spirit animal’ is while racing?
 
Peggy Maass Labiuk (07:00)
We have lots of eagles around here in the Pacific Northwest. I'm still in awe of them. They really strike me, and I have an eagle eye. I spot them all the time. An interesting fact is that the females are the bigger ones.

(Continued below)

More on Cycle Psyched, Published by Spring Cedars:

Picture
(Continued)

Jackie Morreale (07:15)
I didn't know that about eagles. They're one of my favorites.
 
When you were competing at the highest level, what was the difference between a day when you were mentally 'on' and a day when you weren't? Was it something that you could feel at the beginning of a race or during a race, or something that you analyzed after the fact? Did you use those mantras and strategies to improve?
 
Peggy Maass Labiuk (07:36)
I didn't have to think about it afterward, no.
 
Some of my mistakes were epic.
 
Sprinting on the wrong lap. Pulling your foot out.

All the classics.

 
Mostly those were due to fatigue. Cyclists race a lot. Look at the Tour de France. They raced 20 times in 21 days.

We were doing stage races.

 
In the Olympic year, I raced 100 times.
 
Most of the time, you were at a high level of fatigue or just not quite 'on'.

You really did have to work on your mental game and tactics.

 
When I won national championships, those were the days when you peak physically, and mentally, and you perform with ease.
 
You're so in the moment.
 
I remember such details still from those races.
 
It's everything that's described as a peak performance.
 
It just flows. You've done all your preparation. You know the course.
 
Everything just works according to plan and with ease.

 
Jackie Morreale (08:36)
A hundred races in 365 days? So one race every three or four days?
 
Peggy Maass Labiuk (08:42)
Yeah, that's counting training races, like anytime you'd get nervous.
 
Jackie Morreale (08:46)
Did you even have time to get nervous? That schedule's crazy. And that was when you were in flow.
 
Peggy Maass Labiuk (08:51)
You just get your game on.
 
Jackie Morreale (08:53)
Is confidence something that you have or something that you can train?
 
Peggy Maass Labiuk (08:56)
Absolutely train. We have a whole chapter. Chapter eight is on confidence, training it.
 
It's simple. You set goals, you work on them. Your preparation is everything.
 
Your little successes build and you gain confidence.
 
Confidence is absolutely trainable.

 
Although we have one quote, an athlete, Chloé Dygert, she says she goes into every race thinking that she can win. That's confidence.
 
Jackie Morreale (09:21)
Go, Chloé. She knows. She has the confidence.
 
I'm picturing Peggy the Eagle flying past her opposition on the course, doing the impossible on her bike.
 
I love that visualization exercise. Is there a certain chapter in the book that goes into the different animal personifications that athletes can take on?
 
Peggy Maass Labiuk (09:43)
We have good pictures too.
 
Say, Nelson Vails. He was always called 'The Cheetah.' He was a sprinter, and he still does lots of grand fondos around. You might run into him somewhere. He had a bike painted up with cheetah spots. That's in chapter three, Powered Thinking.
 
Jackie Morreale (10:00)
By the way, here's Chloé.
 
The pictures that you used in this book are beautiful. I love seeing it on paper. And here are the wolves.
 
Peggy Maass Labiuk (10:08)
Wolves, yes, the pack.
 
Jackie Morreale (10:10)
There in chapter four.
 
Your book, Cycle Psyched, is written for cyclists, but much of what you're talking about applies to anyone trying to get better at something. If someone is listening today who has been saying, 'Someday I'll...' whether it's racing, starting a business, writing a book, changing careers, or pursuing some other dream, what is the first mental shift that they need to make?
 
Peggy Maass Labiuk (10:31)
I'm thinking about people who might feel stuck, scared, or coming back from an injury.
 
Just do one little thing. Put on your running shoes. Throw your leg over the bike.
 
But document it and celebrate it.
 
Sometimes we minimize what those little things are.
 
They're not little things, they're big steps.
 
You've started, you're going. Make something of that.

​
(Continued below)
Picture
Peggy Maass Labiuk
Picture
Cycle Psyched
(Continued)

Jackie Morreale (10:56)
Do you keep a cycling journal, Peggy?
 
Peggy Maass Labiuk (10:58)
I do. I'm laughing because I still have a box with all the handwritten ones. Of course, now they're on the computer. Not as detailed as I used to be, but it certainly helps me set goals.
 
We have a velodrome here. That's my happy place.
 
I love the velodrome. I train on it and I'll set goals.
 
I want to be able to do a full short intensity workout, so 30 reps.
 
I started with 10, then I went to 17. Then I split it and did seven, eight, nine... in one workout. So, I'm getting there.
 
Making them digestible bites, while documenting and celebrating them each time.

 
Jackie Morreale (11:37)
Wow, you're going to get to 30 any day now; that's an amazing goal.
 
Peggy Maass Labiuk (11:41)
Still have about three weeks. I'll get there.
 
Jackie Morreale (11:44)
It just shows the kind of athlete and competitor that you are. I love that you have a box of data. I'm sure you've had adventures on your bike.
 
If we're thinking about twenty years ago when you wrote your first book together, as you mentioned, data was very different. Not everybody had all the devices to keep track of heart rate, mileage, and GPS.
 
Peggy Maass Labiuk (12:04)
We have all these tools, but you still have one mind, one brain. We're relying on that. That hasn't changed. You still have to tune in to it and use it to drive everything else.
 
Jackie Morreale (12:16)
Love the reminder that confidence can be trained, that small steps are actually big steps, and that sometimes changing the conversation in your own head can change what happens next.

Whether you're an athlete, an artist, an entrepreneur, or simply chasing a goal, there is a lot that we can take from the mental game of cycling and from this amazing new book, Cycle Psyched, by Peggy Maass Labiuk and Dr. Saul Miller.

Thank you for being here, Peggy, and congratulations to you and Dr. Saul Miller on Cycle Psyched, published by Spring Cedars. Thank you to all listening to Wisdom for Wannabes. Until next time, keep learning, keep creating, keep going. See you then.



To learn more about Peggy Maass Labiuk, co-author Dr. Saul Miller, and their new book, Cycle Psyched, visit the Spring Cedars website.


Continued reading, recommended by Peggy Maas Labiuk:

Picture
Harry the Dirty Dog. By Gene Zion (Author), Margaret Bloy Graham (Illustrator). October 1976.
Picture
Sport Psychology for Cyclists. By Saul Miller (Author), Peggy Maass Hill (Author). January 1999.
Picture
Cycle Psyched: Pro Wisdom and the Mental Training to Excel. By Saul L. Miller (Author), Peggy Maass Labiuk (Author). November 2023.
Picture
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  • Home
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  • Courses
  • Podcast Interviews
    • On Business
      • 1: Lorette Pribil on Sales
      • 11: Marc Wharton on Leadership
      • 13: Gary Fails on Entrepreneurship
      • 14: Elizabeth Schlissel on Employment Law
      • 16: William S. Parrish, Jr. on Entrepreneurship
      • 19: Mark Augustyn of Mimi & Moto on Kids Motorcycle Books
      • 22: Arielle Barreto on Corporate Law
      • 23: Charlie Rao on Entrepreneurship
      • 26: Anuk Fernando on AI and Cybersecurity
      • 28: Kevin Pribil on Nonprofit Leadership
      • 32: Johannes Schwab on Aviation
      • 34: Dr. Lee Baucom on Book-to-Business Blueprint
    • On Beauty
      • 2: Steven Joseph Gonsalves on Art
      • 6: Susan Ashdown PhD on Research
      • 9: Zena Frey on Art
      • 10: Trapped Inside My Sin Film
      • 12: Dr. Denise Wunderler on Filmmaking
      • 21: DJ Prashant on Music
      • 24: Keith Gamache on Art
      • 25: Tanya Fraser on Writing
      • 27: Patch Crowe on Media
      • 29: R.G. Taylor on Fine Art and Books
      • 35: Daniele DeMarch on Luxury Experiences
      • 36: Angela Page on Writing
      • 37: Erica Kyle on Art
      • 39: Nani Sahra Walker on Storytelling Through Film
    • On Betterment
      • 3: Scott Vogel on Wildlife Conservation
      • 4: Dr. Roy McGriff on Education
      • 5: Laura Hoffman on Healing
      • 7: Melissa Andrade Costa on Philosophy
      • 8: Joe Iadanza on Spirituality
      • 15: Matthias Schwab on Golf and Life
      • 17: Dianne Marie Nigh and Euell Barnett on Fitness
      • 18: Claudio Navas on Mental Health Awareness for Firefighters
      • 20: Alice Wright on Running
      • 30: Frankie Ruiz on Running Events
      • 31: Dr. Jonathan Jenkins and Dr. Kim O'Brien on Mentality Wins book
      • 33: Raquel Baez on Coaching
      • 38: Sasha Monaco on Books & Business Development
      • 40: Dr. Amy Todey on Family Psychology
      • 41: Peggy Maass Labiuk on Mental Training for Cycling
  • About
    • YouTube Silver Creator Award
    • Anniversary!
    • About Jackie Morreale
    • Press
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